Module 3: Your Sacred Self

9/18/2017

Welcome back!

Our next module invites us to new terrain as spiritual guides in terms of understanding our ego and the role it plays in personal transformation; in our ability to be fully and lovingly present to ourselves and others.

Download and print out the Module 3 requirements here:
http://www.awakenedliving.com/SGTI/Module3.pdf

Enjoy and be blessed!

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Once you leave a comment or question, be sure to put a check mark in the box that says you wish to be notified of responses. When someone comments on the module, you will receive notification of their response in your e-mail inbox. We will be checking in regularly to address comments.

Please try to post module-based questions here, rather than sending us a separate e-mail. It will be easier to keep Q & A in one place, so everyone benefits. Of course, if you have a question of a more personal nature, please e-mail us.

We hope you will check in once each week to let us know how you are doing and to connect with your classmates.

Let the conversation begin! We welcome your thoughts and look forward to chatting it up with you!

“A feeling of aversion or attachment toward something is your clue
that there’s work to be done.”
~ Ram Dass

16 Comments

Jeffrey Phillips

9/29/2017 11:28:57 am

RQ 1. This module is very helpful to me as I have a lot to work on in this regard, and therefore a lot to benefit from. I find it encouraging to hear Nathans say that we continually shift back and forth between the "ego state" and the "transformational state." I take this to mean that all day long we go in and out of awareness about being aware of self and other. It is good to hear an "expert" say this because it allows "self-compassion" for someone like me who would like to think that there will be a breakthrough moment when I am completely transformed, fully and continually aware of self and other. No. It's back and forth all the time - even for people much further along the path than I. I also appreciate hearing that "ego" is not all bad. As Nathans says, and as Jan notes in her teaching, it's about growing in our ability to notice ego, name it, and then find ways to gently set it aside. I love this, and am grateful for these insights.

RQ2. It is indeed psychological work, and this brings to mind a larger question I've had for years: what is the relationship between therapy and spiritual direction? I can describe the distinction between the two, but how do they interact and overlap? In light of this module, I am particularly curious about how those who seek to be spiritual guides, but who struggle more than most with the ego, can benefit from therapy. Are some personalities so fraught with worry, fear, and insecurity that it is harder for them than for others to settle down, let go of all that, and focus on others? Maybe we will learn this in later modules, but what is the relationship between "personality types" (as identified by Myers-Briggs, the Enneagram, etc.) and spiritual guidance? Are introverts just better suited for this work than extroverts? What about those of us who are just chatty by nature (a sign of an ego that needs attention)? "Type-A" and "doer" personalities rather than "Type-B" and "be-ers"? Can we be effective spiritual guides? I fear that personality traits like these are so ingrained that they pose insurmountable obstacles to those who seek to be orientated to the other. Can a leopard change its spots? RQ 2 is asking about referring a seeker to a therapist for ego work. I'm wondering more about the would-be spiritual guide with a "strong sense of self," as someone once described me. Is there hope for us? Can a regular spiritual practice help manage the ego? If so, isn't spiritual guidance itself somewhat therapeutic? Is that what Nathans is saying ("spiritual direction helps to be able to 'transcend the ego'")? If so, what is the practical difference between the two in this regard?

Jeanette

10/2/2017 11:14:42 am

Yes, wonderful and important comments and questions, Jeffrey. Unfortunately, we do not know exactly what Nathans meant when she said that SD serves to transcend the ego and how she was differentiating SD from therapy.

As you are aware, there is a wonderful - healing - relationship between therapy and SG. On a personal note, I have gone to therapy and SG at the same time for a couple years. I knew that I was ready to let go of therapy when some issues were resolved. However, I kept going with SG... why? Where therapy oftentimes has an endpoint, SG can last as long as you or anyone want/s to talk about life.

Regarding personality, behavior, problem-solving, and other inventories or systems... Each type can absolutely serve both the guide and seeker, as well as "get in the way" of growth and movement in either the guide or seeker. Personality can change (unlike a leopard's spots). This is important for us as guides lest we fall into the myth that our seekers (or we) will forever deal with the same issues.

Keep going with your question about SD being therapeutic. Also, Thomas Keating and Cynthia Bourgeault have wonderful explanations about the psychology of centering prayer.

We will be exploring this much more later on, but we are glad you are bringing it up now.

Jan

9/29/2017 10:13:29 pm

Jeffrey, your questions and noticings are astute. Yes, first and foremost, spiritual direction IS spiritual formation, not just as training for the charism, but training in self awareness. The everyday process of being a spiritual guide is ongoing spiritual formation if we are fully present to ourselves as we are in any given moment. Every encounter invites us to notice our ego. Our noticing gets easier with a consistent meditation or centering prayer practice. We become more transparent, open, and pliable. It begins with intention, of course, that this is what we want for ourselves - to be open, to be Jesus, to be Buddha, yes? So that we can be servants to others and live together into the Love of the Absolute.

On the other hand, can a spiritual guide be operating from ego? Absolutely! As it can for a spiritual teacher or for anyone for that matter. The "spiritual ego" is very slippery, convincing us that we are wise or illuminated or especially gifted.

Genuine spiritual practice, done consistently over time, is essential for this very purpose: for us to see ego operating clearly so we can develop a new, compassionate relationship with it.

A true story: many years ago during my training program, I was talking with my spiritual direction teacher about what to do after the training was complete. Should I get a DMin, or go to an interfaith seminary or what? I was certain something was "next" for me that would help me "advance" beyond where I was now.

His advice: Don't do anything he said. Just go do spiritual direction. It will teach you everything you need to know about life.

He was right. :-)

Jane Supri

10/4/2017 09:17:22 am

RQ 1: In the video Dr. Nathans talks about how we often are either in an “ego state or transformational (spirit) state” and the importance of being aware of where we may be in a discussion. I liked how she described herself as more of a spiritual facilitator – to “stay out of the way” while guiding the seeker gently on their path. Her perspective emphasized how important it is to fully listen to the seeker and help them realize what is significant in their spiritual life and how that connects them to the Sacred. It was interesting that she stated the ego had an important role - it’s not about getting rid of the ego (as we are often told) but rather bringing the ego under the direction of a higher level of consciousness. Rabbi Rami also referred to this in his video in the previous module. In addition, Jan, in her “Your Sacred Self” discussion talked about how the ego can be useful and that we to develop a more mature relationship with our ego. To me, it’s about learning to become self-aware so we can discern when and how our ego wants to speak and then decide if it has something genuine to say that will elevate the situation/conversation or if it just wants to speak to elevate itself. I think if a person is open to listening and understanding an alternative perspective with respect, then they are generally coming from the transformed state (consciousness) than from an ego state. It is so important to just ask “help me understand” to avoid falling into judgement. Taking a dispassionate point of view of the discussion with a seeker can help keep an objective perspective of the conversation. The practice of noticing and discerning what triggers a “ping” during a discussion can be really helpful to improve self-awareness of those things I may need to work on to develop as an effective spiritual guide. If the seeker is open to discussing spirituality in their life and they genuinely wants to better understand what it means to them and deepen their relationship with the Divine, then I think spiritual direction/guidance could really help them to transcend their ego and realize that it is important to be open to change and work on their inner self. Since I am a seeker as well, working through this in myself is very important to me.

RQ 2: It think that the discernment whether a seeker might need to be referred for therapy develops with experience as a spiritual guide. If a seeker seems to be primarily concerned with what they believe and are not very open to understanding other perspectives, then they probably need to work on their ego to learn to be open to understanding their spirituality. Or, as Jan states that if the discussion comes mostly from the perspective of “I” or “me”, then it probably from the ego. But learning to recognize and work on the ego doesn’t necessarily mean that therapy is needed. If a seeker is talking quite a bit about things that seem to be “roadblocks” in their life and/or is having difficulty coping with life issues then (if they are open to it) it might be a good idea to suggest gently that perhaps therapy may help them – or, better yet, help them come to that awareness themselves. The important thing is to help a seeker on their path and being aware of what they may need along the way.

Jeanette

10/4/2017 02:54:41 pm

Thank you, Jane! One of the lines that stands out to me is "To me, it’s about learning to become self-aware so we can discern when and how our ego wants to speak and then decide if it has something genuine to say that will elevate the situation/conversation or if it just wants to speak to elevate itself." I love the distinction between elevating a situation/conversation and elevating the ego. Here is an article about elevating the conversation from Huffington Post that speaks of strategies to be positive and respond to negativity, mean-spiritedness, and trash-talking http://www.huffingtonpost.com/laura-berman-fortgang/positive-attitude_b_1799312.html.
As you mention, fully listening and being open to listening seem to be ways of elevating a conversation.

Jane Supri

10/4/2017 04:33:39 pm

Jeanette,I read the article you mentioned and saved a copy for reference. It had some very useful points. Thanks for the feedback

Jan

10/5/2017 04:59:40 pm

Jane, thank you for this reflection. It tells me you are paying close attention to this, leaning in, listening deeply - and that is what SG is allo about. First, within yourself, obviously, and secondly, where ego may be directing/guiding the seeker.

I personally believe that illuminating the ego is not just a psychological/therapeutic practice, because the ego can keep us disconnected from true self and God. It can provide huge barriers with its stories/needs that actually keep God quite distanced from us.

I don't see how we can help talk about ego with seekers at some point in time. To not do so would be to allow their spiritual health to remain in peril.

I refer someone to therapy when issues are causing great difficulty on any level. If prayer is not enough, if practices don't provide breakthrough moments. Also especially when someone has compulsions and addictions that are causing pain and suffering. By their own admission, they generally know this already and have read the signs, so to speak. Sometimes it seems that SG is a good first (and safe) place to illuminate the issue and receive affirmation that therapy might be needed.

Barbara

10/4/2017 07:15:31 pm

Reflection Questions re: Ego vs transformational or spiritual work

I really appreciated both Dr Nathan’s interview and Jan’s teaching about ego and spirit. Being reminded that ego is not something that is bad and needs to be overcome, but is an essential part of who we are. Our work is not to squash the ego but to help it mature.

At least in the spiritual conversations I’ve had thus far, I have noticed what I think is ego at work. My thoughts/concerns/ ideas/ worries taking up more space in my mind than the words of the seeker I am companioning. It has been a bit more subtle than some other places in my life where I feel myself “triggered” and want to defend myself or react in some other unproductive way.

I think I will be helped to discern what state I’m in by answering the question…” for whom will this idea/feeling/etc be useful….me or the other person”
If I’m acting in a way that is intended to take care of my own discomfort, I think that’s the ego at work.

I liked Dr Nathan’s comments a lot. But I felt like Jan’s teaching was a bit more inclusive…..that maybe Spiritual direction does not require “transcending the ego” But noticing what’s coming up and seeing if there are ways to include it and help the ego mature. Re psychotherapy….if a person is stuck in old stories that preclude their ability to become present to the mystery/spirit available in the present moment, then I might think therapy would be useful (either instead of or along with spiritual guidance). I think it might take a few sessions with a seeker to determine how “stuck” the person is.
And of course, serious symptoms (depression, anxiety etc) that interfere with daily living would be another reason to refer.

AND I love hearing about the 90 Second Rule. I expect to find situations everyday when I use this tool and the practice of acknowledging, naming, resting and moving on

Jan

10/5/2017 07:43:14 pm

Barbara, I appreciate your insights here about what feels right to you in terms of understanding ego. We each have our own interpretation, of course, and we each must find the best way to relate so we optimize our experience of divine-humanity. I like how you are going to stay attuned to the question, "How will this benefit the other?" Truly, this is one of the best ways to assess how we are being within ourselves in service of another's process. Sounds like you are doing just fine. May you carry on with ease and clarity of heart-mind.

Jeffrey Phillips

10/6/2017 01:45:58 pm

Part II

RQ1. This is a wonderful chapter. I appreciated being spoken to positively by adults when I was a child, and have tried as an adult (pastor, father, and grandfather) to speak that way to children - and to listen to children likewise: interacting with them as a fellow human being. Even for those of us who were affirmed in our childhood conversations, it is still good to be reminded that the need for such affirmations ("nutritional attention") continue in adulthood. I like the concept and phrase "daily minimum requirement of psychological needs." It helps me remember that, in every encounter I have with someone, I can give them one of their six required daily units (I know this is gimmicky and arbitrary, but it helps me remember it!). We all need these experiences of "attunement" throughout the day. What I struggle with is all the wonderful people I meet every day who seem to want to GIVE attention rather than RECEIVE it. I am serving a church full of people who are skilled and intentional about deflecting any psychological need they may have by turning the conversation to the other person as soon as possible. I try to turn it back to them, and a ping pong game is off and running. At least I am paying attention to this dynamic, and will seek ways to be the best listener and "feeder" I can be. These exchanges are indeed felt in the body (p. 45).

RQ2. I appreciate this concept of a conversation as an experience of shared energy, and that it can be more important to pay attention to the energy (yours and the other person's) than the precise content of the exchange. I've noticed this for a while, so it was good to see it in print - the idea that certain conversations can really 'rev" us up, and be the highlight (or lowlight) of our day. I sometimes come away from a conversation on such a high that, if I am honest, it is the best moment of my day. And it isn't so much the content as it is that the other person and I had a deep emotional connection. Often, it is the humor, shared values, the successful completion of something, or just something good that happened that gets the juices flowing. I am left with an "afterglow" that brightens the rest of my day. I am aware that conversations can have negative energy as well, but even those ones can connect me to a person I may have been avoiding, or clarify or advance the relationship in a necessary way. Those conversations don't have an "afterglow," but they are still full of emotional energy.

Jan

10/7/2017 01:00:12 pm

Jeffrey, I love what your noticing about relationships and the nature of our interactions. Your take-a-way from the material is spot on and I agree with you about the "daily minimum requirement of psychological needs." What's amazing to me is that many individuals who come to SG come because they are not receiving this daily dose from family, work or community. The SG relationship is so nurturing and nourishing to them. I appreciate the intention you are holding for this new congregation too, that you might help them stay focused and receive, instead of deflect. Sounds like much healing can happen!

Jane Supri

10/8/2017 09:21:07 am

The Wisdom of Listening

Chapter 3: Feeding One Another
I thought this chapter was a clever way to describe psychological malnutrition in terms of physical nutrition. Having a background in nutrition and healthcare for many years I can appreciate the analogy. If adequate nutrition is not taken in, the body suffers; if adequate psychological nutrition is not taken in, the spirit suffers.
On page 36, the authors state, “Today the development of an inner self is necessary for providing direction because many of the old external supports no longer function as a compass and guide.” In my experience when talking with people, seeking psychotherapy still carries somewhat of a stigma today but I am finding more and more in my conversations that they mention they see a therapist. I find this heartening because they feel safe in our discussion to disclose this personal information, and also because I too have sought therapy at different times in my life. Sometimes we may discuss it further, sometimes we just let it float over the conversation.
I thought for a long while that difficulties experienced in my family environment growing up was uncommon because no one talked about it. But not so – as an adult I’ve realized there are many people that struggled physically and psychologically growing up and are still searching for positive ways to cope in their lives. This may be one reason why seeking therapy is so prevalent. And it’s a good thing that now receiving some type of counseling is accepted and even encouraged to work through difficult times.
With the increase in mobility in our lives and the decrease in the structure of the traditional family unit, we now each seem to be on our own to “forage” for our psychological nutrition. We no longer have the storehouse of “nutritious psychological food” to draw upon as we had a few years ago. This increases our lack of sustenance for our psychological needs.
It seems to me that one of the most basic human needs is to feel a sense of worth and significance – to know that you matter just as you are. Generally, people act in the way they do (whether it is helpful or not) using ego-based tactics because these strategies compensate for what they lack. The authors point out that realizing a sense of self-worth cannot be done alone, it must be done through interaction with others. That is why it is so important that we all learn to see each other as valuable persons. We need to listen with intention and attention to genuinely connect and see the other person without expectations or judgement. If we expect this from others we need to practice it ourselves.

Chapter 18: Fierce Listening
I was both surprised and pleased to see this question asking about experiences of connecting with someone beyond words – in an energetic sense. I was surprised that others also recognize this energy exchange and pleased with the opportunity to express my experiences of sensing energy in connection with others.
A feeling of connection with another person is very important not only for understanding, but also for trust. Being in the same space in with the other person is where a genuine connection occurs. In my experience, the energy of consciousness is exchanged in an encounter by connecting within an immediate space that results from the sharing and interaction of all the senses. I have noticed that cues from body language can be many times more important in conveying the message being communicated than the actual words that are spoken. The body always communicates, sometimes very loudly and we need to be aware to understand what is being said nonverbally. I am an intuitive person, and I can often sense the meaning of someone’s body language, but I think that reading body language at some level is instinctual from the human need for security and belonging. Communicating through technology over distances and sensing an energy connection is also possible, but I think it takes much experience and great skill.
Since I’m so much of a listener, loving to hear the stories of others, I’ve developed or noted a deep sense of connection when interacting with someone. I liken it to almost a “reading” (for lack of a better word) of the other person’s energy, observing even minute changes in mood, movements, tone, eye contact – sensing even beyond just listening and seeing. So, I guess I always sense some type of energy when interacting with a person. Sometimes during a conversation I can sense when the energy level changes and needs to be “reset”. Usually the energy sensed in an interaction is positive and there have been times when I’ve strongly felt a connection that I’ve known this person even though we’ve only just met. In a few instances when it has seemed quite powerful I will mention it and, invariably,

Jeanette

10/8/2017 02:51:21 pm

Thank you, Jane, for this reflection. Your point about increasing self-worth and the need for people interaction is an important one. Indeed, encouraging seekers through their journey is one practice you as guide can do. Today I was meeting with someone and I encouraged her as she was asking questions about her strengths related to her job. Reflective listening, or mirroring, is one way to do this.

Becky

10/9/2017 11:00:22 am

I'm combining my responses for both questions in this first area. Sometimes, even after hours of research and listening, I still get a little mystified by ego. I find that I often have a hard time knowing where ego begins and ends and it seems quite fuzzy, as if there is a great deal of gray area. Maybe, as my practice changes, this will become a bit more clear, or even better, I will be able to recognize this a bit sooner in the moment rather than later in a time of reflection. I think, when I am seeking deeper understanding, I tend to think of the ego as a form of motivation....what is my motivation behind an action (or lack there of) or what is my motivation to a response? Or, sometimes, I ask myself, what is his/her motivation, what is that person getting or giving that is causing that particular action or non-action? When I ask those questions, I think the truth behind something is revealed, often.

I also think that could begin to set the stage for determining when someone (myself or others) should transcend or work on their ego? If I am not content with the motivation behind an activity then working on changing the ego. If the motivation is pure and the response seems to give me pause, or feel unaligned, then possibly transcending the ego would be a better choice?

Becky

10/9/2017 02:46:08 pm

1. Chapter 3 discusses the importance of psychological nutrition. What are some of the causes of your psychological malnutrition? What are some of the nutrients (psychologically, emotionally, mentally, etc.) that contribute to your overall health?

I love the connectivity between the whole body-mind, emotions, kinesthetic, and thoughts. Balance is what primary contributes to my overall health, however, it typically has to be partnered with some sort of forward motion. Knowing that about myself helps me recognizing the importance of balance and quiet and breath. If I am not balanced, giving one area more attention, it always costs in another area-impacting one part of the whole.

2. The last part of chapter 18 describes conversations as an exchange of energy. Have you ever experienced a conversation where you connected with someone beyond the words? Describe it.

Yes. Sometimes moments are electric...when there is a shared experience that goes beyond the presence of two individuals and seems to take on a surreal experience. There's something esoteric about that kind of energy collision. The thing is, sometimes the connection isn't a positive reflection of energy...sometimes it is electric energies that collide can take on multiple manifestations-creating a charge but not always as desirable as deep connection.

Jan

10/9/2017 06:32:44 pm

Becky, thanks for checking in and sharing. I appreciate that you know yourself well enough to know that your well-being is about balance AND forward movement. Over the years I have come to prefer the term "harmony" over balance. For me, balance is always a juggling act; a little more of this, a little less of that. And balance by its very nature is impossible to achieve. Think of a teeter totter.... Rarely does it sit smack dab in the middle, perfectly poised on that fulcrum. Harmony, however, is a feeling state of being in alignment within one's self. Harmony works for me and feels gentler, more self-compassionate. And wise, as it is so important to know ourselves, as you state here.

Module 3: Your Sacred Self

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